Why can't we get potty trained?

I dimly recall that I regressed in potty-training for a while with each move until I was five. It came back faster each time though.

Or maybe she's just marking her new territory.

It sounds like the moving is a major culprit, but have you asked your pediatrician? I know sometimes Dr.s are not all that helpful, but ours is great and I would trust her to be compassionate and objective about the whole thing. And who knows, maybe there is a physical reason?

Hang in there -- it'll happen!

Shaun

definitely double-check the physical side to be sure you can rule that out. Believe me that's no fun either if they take it to extremes (been there, done that, and it involves and television screens - my memory held on to that one a bit too tightly!) but there are some things you can rule out pretty easily.

I would however second the moving as the main cause. And very likely you're getting more and more frustrated with her as she keeps regressing each time she's older. Keep her bedding to a washing minimum so you won't get frustrated - fleece blankets are a fantastic invention! Try to look for patterns and maybe even set timers to remind her to go every hour or so. Perhaps she's just getting caught up in things so it seems to be getting worse.

DS5 1/2 is still not dry at night, but he knows the routine and so do I if he's wet, so there's a minimum of fuss to be made by anyone. He's even stopped fussing about being showered in the middle of the night! And he knows how to strip his bed if he wakes up wet in the morning too. Just think what a great mother your daughter will make if she has to deal with the same thing with her own kids!

there's a bright side to anything if you can st for just long enough to see it.

Kerri.

She pooped in her panties, left them on the floor of the bathroom, may have tried to wipe, couldn't tell, and went back to play with a dirty bottom. Got poop all over her dress and the couch cushion. THEN, she comes and tells me that her dress is "bothering" her and I discover the poop.

You all are probably right about seeing the doctor, I need to find one closer to where we live now.

One thing I know is that she dislikes going poo-poo. She says it makes her "mad", sometimes "going" hurts her, and in general she just doesn't like the whole sensation of going poo-poo and that is a big part of it. Maybe we should play "poo-poo" with some brown play-doh and talk about it.

The timer idea is a pretty good one. She sleeps in pull-ups (we call them "night-time panties") and right now she wakes up dry about 50% of the time.

No wet accidents today, just the #2s. Once or twice a week we won't have any accidents at all. I'll get my hopes up then she'll go on a potty spree. Argh.

Must call her pediatricians office on Monday to see if she can recommend anyone closer to us.
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May The Hair On Your Toes Never Fall Out

--Traditional Hobbit Blessing

If she's having pain on defecation, there are definitely plenty of things a doctor can do for that.

now you're on a subject we can identify with! Could just be lack of veggies and fruits if she's anything like my DD, and maybe lack of water too in the summer, if it's hot where you are.

Kerri.

they're coming a bit too slow for me to get them all in one post this morning!

I realise you ran out of panties so you resorted to pull-ups. I'm just not really that wild about pull-ups in some ways. It tends to let kids think they can relax their vigilance on potty training because they know they're basically wearing a nappy. If you can let her go bare bum for a few days, or offer that choice to her perhaps, it might make it more obvious to her when she needs to go.

I've never done pull-ups at night with DS either, and DD didn't really need them because she's part camel anyway. It's probably just me, but there's always the awareness that they aren't a big leap from a nappy, and I'd be concerned about self-esteem issues in a child of 4 or 5 wearing pull-ups - that's why I haven't resorted to them, and I do my utmost to stomp on any joking about it from other adult family members. I'd rather let the whole issue become a non-issue and let it sort itself out with time and positive encouragement. For DS we get him out to the toilet when we go to bed, so it's a couple or three hours after he's initially gone to sleep, and that seems to make a big difference most of the time. He either wets in those first few hours or in the last one or two (like this morning when he woke me up at 5:15am - small wonder if my thoughts are coming slow today!).

I think your doctor should likely be saying that it's not uncommon for children of that age to be having accidents. The only concern is that the frequency seems to rise with each move, which would seem to indicate an underlying emotional difficulty wiht the moves, rather than anything else. Which reminds me... have you talked to her about how she feels about moving?? How did she feel before the moves?? Was she angry at having to leave friends, sad, or apparently not bothered?? Those are questions your doctor might be asking, and it might be easier for you to give them than for her to be asked them in the doctor's office. Just try talking to her now about the move, ask her how she feels about it now it's done.

I'm done for today!

Kerri.

The good news is, no accidents today!

Kerri, she drinks water like a fish, that's one reason we have trouble with accidents! I try to get her to go every hour or two but when she guzzles two or three glasses of water in ten minutes, I can't get her to the potty often enough! With the summer fruits and veggies she's had a lot in her diet--watermelon, grapes, and beans were what she ate for lunch! She loves fruits and veggies. And, may I say, at the risk of Two Much Information, that her BM today reflected her meal. Thankfully she was on the potty when she "went". I did notice that she hardly strained at all and the whole thing was over fairly quickly. It's funny how she always bends over to look as she does it, she's very curious about the whole thing. I think the more difficult BMs in the past, though, did coincide with less fruits and veggies in the diet, because we were low on them, or she didn't want any at that time.

About the move, she was very excited about it, she'd seen the house twice before we moved and kept chattering about the backyard, the flowers, the swingset, she was eager to move to the house. However, once we moved, she showed a lot of insecurity, which may be near the heart of the issue. She won't go into the backyard by herself, she has to know where we are and if we aren't where she thinks we are she gets very upset. She thought I was in the garden a few days ago, but when she couldn't find me there she fell apart and cried miserably until she saw me again, despite the fact that Daddy was in the backyard with her. I'd gone to the front yard to move the sprinkler. And that's happened several times inside when she thought I was in the kitchen but was in the bathroom or something.

So she's happy with the new house, but she's insecure, and keeps asking me when we're moving again. I keep telling her we are here to stay, this is our home, we're going to live here all the time now. I think the permanence is just going to have to sink in over time.

I did notice a few days ago that when she starts to run madly around the house at top speed for no apparent reason, she needs to go potty. It's as though she doesn't know what to do about it. I now think physically, emotionally, and mentally, she's just got a couple of short circuts, so to speak. Maybe as we continue to unpack and get her things about her, she'll settle in.

Going barebottom doesn't work at all with us. I tried it for three months, but we had so many doctors appointments and playgroups and errands and things that she was only barebottom a few hours a day when we were home. She'd simply poop on the carpet or pee on the couch.

My least favorite is when she poops in the bathtub. She's only done it twice since we moved, but boy does that take a while to clean up. And it's frustrating, because the potty is right there, three feet away. And the most frustrating thing is trying not to be frustrated when I am, and trying not to get upset or angry when she spreads poop all over the place, and trying to be supportive and understanding when I often don't understand.

I do really try to not place any guilt or shame on her for accidents, I try to be matter of fact and calmly reminder her that we go pee and poop in the potty to keep our panties and ourselves and our home clean. I try to not place a stigma on accidents, but when I'm tired or when it's the third time that day, those things creep in to my dealing with it.

And I agree with you about pull-ups. I HATE pull-ups. They are a total impediment to potty training, studies show that it takes children longer to potty train when they're used, and as a person who worked in three different daycares, I can honestly say they're a pestilence on this planet. When you have nine two year olds to change in the winter, all of whom are in pull ups, it takes friggin forever, because you have to take off the pants, the shoes, then put them back on, it makes a twenty minute changing schedule turn into a fourty minute one. I only use them at night because I can't handle the wet bed every night. I tried it in the beginning of potty training, and I just can't handle it. Changing the sheets, blanket, pillow, and her clothes at two a.m. then again at six a.m.--that lasted a grand total of three days. Forget it. I despise pull ups, but that's what she's gonna have to wear until she's dry at night.

And you're right, she knows what they are. No matter how many times I explain that these are pants to wear at night, she calls them diapers. But what else can I do? I won't change the sheets twice night every night, I just can't do it. I am not a supermom. I'm not even a great mom, I'm a "good enough" mom. As such, I have my limits.

I'm calling around in the morning for pediatricians on this side of the river. And a doctor or two for me, as well. I need some blood tests and new prescription written out, I'm on my last refill of my sythetic thyroid. Can't let that go.

Thanks again, all for your comments and suggestions, this has been a big help to me. Big hugs and kisses all around.
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May The Hair On Your Toes Never Fall Out

--Traditional Hobbit Blessing

Has her blood sugar been checked lately? If she's drinking and peeing a LOT, not just in the wrong places, it might be worth a stick.

She was only drinking so much water when it was so hot out. We had many really hot days of summer, and our apartment and our new house didn't and don't have air conditioning. On the hot days, she would pack down the water, for which I was thankfull, but then she'd have to pee every fourty five minutes or so, which I wasn't used to. Now that the weather has cooled, she's back to normal.

I'm taking her to a pedatrician on Friday, though, I'll ask about that while I'm there.

The good news is, we've been accident free for three days! However, the bad news is that this is due in part to her not having gone poo for the past two days. Don't understand why, she's had lots of fruit and veggies. She'll occasionally go for one day without any BMs and the next day have twice as many as usual, but I can't remember the last time she went for two days. We're probably going to have a big mess tomorrow.

On the upside, she IS telling us (for the past two days) when she needs to go potty! Yay!
______

May The Hair On Your Toes Never Fall Out

--Traditional Hobbit Blessing

In any case, she WILL be potty trained again, and probably will not regress when she goes to college and moves into a dorm.

frustrating but that sounds like your best bet! Actually, it might have been an idea to take advantage of the warmer weather and keep her bedding light, easy to change, easy to wash and dry - did I mention how much I LOVE fleece blankets!?! Not sure how much longer the warm weather lasts where you are.

At least with her asking about when you're going to move again you're getting a signpost as to where the problems lie. Again, only time will effect the cure, but anything that will increase her sense of permanence will be helpful... ummm... like... ummm... putting her name on her bedroom door, or... ummm... well, putting her name on anything really. Something that marks her territory in a long-term way. In fact, if you can swing it, it might be worth decorating her bedroom specially, perhaps before you get on with other major projects.

I think I'm all out of ideas now, and it looks like there are other potty posts popping up, so I'm gonna have a quick peek over there too...

Kerri.

Decorating her room and setting up the playroom will really help her feel "established" I think. We'd make more progress unpacking except the fruit and veggies in our mini-orchard and garden are ready for harvest and preserving, and we're spending evenings peeling, coring, and slicing a mountain of fruit and tomatoes.

I need to get the sewing machine out and hem the curtains for her window and go get the paint for the walls. And some toy shelves for the family room to put her toys on. Sigh. I never thought it could happen, but I think I am actually starting to get "shopped out". An era has ended.
______

May The Hair On Your Toes Never Fall Out

--Traditional Hobbit Blessing