Ann C. is hateful, hateful, hateful, and doesn't add a lot to any debate in my opinion. My "traditional liberal and proud of it" schoolteacher brother is about to be deployed overseas. He volunteered for the National Guard after 9/11 because (at the age of 28) he felt it was his duty to his country. Blithe comments like hers, which I used to dismiss as willful ignorance, just make me feel sick and angry now. She's made other comments about liberals being afraid to fight, etc. BTW, my DB met a lot of other liberals at boot camp and subsequent training, who had similar motivations.